cedrus
Junior Member
split personality
Posts: 51
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Post by cedrus on May 16, 2005 9:17:57 GMT -5
Since I'm currently a statue, I thought I should post here in the out of game section.
I wanted to second Winthrop and Dell's comments about what went wrong, especially about the way we keep getting jammed up in corridors.
I think, too, we had a problem with overconfidence. We're so used to slaughtering everything we encounter that we let ourselves get a bit carried away when we ran into more challenging enemies. This was most damaging when we started opening doors left and right (I'm not talking about the medusa; I'll mention that further down). Each time we opened another door, the complexity of the situation increased. (Probably whenever a door is opened, there should be two or three people ready to attack whatever's inside. Too many doors were opened yesterday without proper backup.) If we were at full strength and had enough space to maneuver in, that wouldn't have been a problem, but since we were already scattered (and since by the end Josh and David weren't there to help us figure out what to do), we ended up in big trouble.
I think with the slaver room, too, our overconfidence hurt us. It was obvious there was something strange about the room, probably magical, but instead of waiting by the entrance trying to figure out what was going on, four or five people barged into the room as if it were completely safe. Then, when Otto started vomiting, there was still no overall coordination. At that point, there should have been a retreat and discussion, probably. (Of course, it's easy to say this after the fact, but if we had to do that part over again, I think we'd want to be much more cautious). Once the fight with the Cloaker began, though, we were pretty much screwed. I don't know what else we could have done except what we did. Blunt weapons might have been the answer, but the only one with blunt weapons *raises hand* was already out of commission.
As for the medusa, that, too, was probably based on overconfidence (it was clear that Lydia was going to be trouble of some sort, but none of us would have suspected she'd be something Cedrus and Pavel (who were in the room at the time, with six or seven others within shouting distance) couldn't handle. Since Winthop himself was hesitating to open the door, he shouldn't have told Cedrus to open it, but still, I think we were all surprised by the outcome. (I think, too, that if Cedrus had known that Winthrop was hesitating, and if he had heard Lydia when she said "Icar, you bastard, open the door," he might have questioned Winthrop's order. I think, though, that I played it correctly: Cedrus runs into a room, tells Winthrop to go save everybody, Winthrop hands him a key and says, open this door, Cedrus hears that there's a woman behind the door, trapped with treasure, he assumes Winthrop had just gotten the key and was about to open the door, and so he opens it. I can't think of a reason why Cedrus would have disobeyed Winthrop's order.) Anyway, it's no big deal; whoever opened the door was going to be turned to stone unless they made the saving throw. We're lucky more of us weren't affected.
By the way, what was the metal thing that Dell bumped up against in the darkness? Is it still lying in the corridor? Was it just a weapon?
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Post by Ginger on May 16, 2005 11:56:43 GMT -5
I hate to critique since I wasn't there, but it seems like a bad idea for anyone to do anything when there's a fight on. I know it's annoying for a long train of people to wait while the few guys in the front fight, but that's what's got to be done.
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cedrus
Junior Member
split personality
Posts: 51
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Post by cedrus on May 16, 2005 13:20:52 GMT -5
A little coordination, though, will help. For instance, if we're about to open a door, we could take a moment to make sure that spellcasters and bowmen are in position to respond if they're needed. Yesterday, too, there was an overall lack of coordination in the way we were opening some of the doors. For instance:
____{}__{}_____{}____ ------Y x x x x x x x x x x x _____________________
x = people Y = person about to open a door {} = closed door - = nothing, just spaces because I can't seem to make the spacing work any other way on this post.
Now in this case, person Y (the leftmost person) is about to open a door. So whatever's in the room, there's only one or two people who can respond to it. Also, there are two other doors which we passed by without securing first. A better strategy in this case would be:
____{}__{}_____{}_________ ------------ x---x x Y x x x x x x x x __________________________
Here, three to five people are ready to face whatever's in the first room, one person is hanging out ahead guarding the corridor. Once that room is secured, we move on to the next and the next in a similar manner.
Bunching up and waiting is inevitable to a point, but we're much more effective when we take the time to make a marching order and when more than one person is prepared when a door is opened. Normally, we seem to do that pretty well, but yesterday we kind of fell apart.
Also, of course in retrospect Cedrus was a complete idiot to open a padlocked door in the middle of a battle. Withrop told me to do it and I saw no logical reason at the time to question his words, but by no means am I implying that Winthrop is to blame for what happened. The overall lack of coordination and overconfidence just added up to disaster.
What should have happened, I'm guessing, is that we should have waited to open the door until all the fighting was over, and then Dell would have captured someone and, upon questioning, discovered that there was a medusa somewhere. We would have put two and two together and figured out that Lydia = medusa, and all would be well.
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Post by Dell on May 16, 2005 14:17:17 GMT -5
Our marching order is a little out of whack, too. Here's what we need:
The lowest AC's need to be in the lead. Ironhand has the WORST AC in the entire party, he shouldn't be in front. No charging around corners without backup. No doing anything without backup. If the cloaker had attacked while Otto, Al, and Winthrop were there on their own... well, there would have been more casualties than just Al.
Also, we need to have spellcasters close enough to the front that they can see, but far enough back that they don't get hit.
And we need a cleric.
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Post by Ginger on May 17, 2005 8:22:58 GMT -5
Our marching order is a little out of whack, too. Here's what we need: The lowest AC's need to be in the lead. Now that's leadership. Since Dell has the lowest AC (-2), he is volunteering to always be the first into combat.
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Post by Dell on May 17, 2005 9:22:38 GMT -5
Now that's leadership. Since Dell has the lowest AC (-2), he is volunteering to always be the first into combat. Actually, Dell would be third. Dell can't deal very much damage, so if he's in front he might not be getting hit, but he won't be able to drop whatever is attacking. I'm thinking Otto needs to be in front, then Raven, and then Dell. Otto for his melee and tracking skills, Dell for his spells and trap-finding, and Raven because he kills things. The cleric would go in the middle of the party, as far away from any harm as possible.
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Post by Wolfgar on May 17, 2005 10:39:31 GMT -5
I'm thinking Otto needs to be in front, then Raven, and then Dell. Otto for his melee and tracking skills, Dell for his spells and trap-finding, and Raven because he kills things. And let's not forgot my ability not to be surprised. I am happy to go in front. As soon as I can get some sleep I will go up another level so that should give me a good number of h.p. and a modified THAC0 of at most 11 using my sword and assuming my strength is over 18. Also I think we should have standard marching orders for both 5 and 10 foot corridors. For 10 foot corridors it might still be Otto in font with Raven and Al in the second row, followed by Dell and the cleric with Winthrop in back. Or maybe Otto and Al in the front. Raven behind Al so he can still get shoots off with Dell and then Winthrop and the cleric in back. How do we want to arrange the Saltmarsh men?
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Post by Ginger on May 17, 2005 10:57:12 GMT -5
I can also probably be persuaded to part with my +2 longsword if we find an alternative weapon down here.
Also, are we assuming that Al will rejoin the marching order? He might want to retire.
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Post by Mr. Trommer on May 17, 2005 11:31:55 GMT -5
To answer one of Cedrus's original questions it was probably Al that Dell ran in to while in the darkness.
I expect that we will want to send some of the Saltmarsh men back to the cave with the released slaves. That would obvioulsy include Ironhand since he can't fight after being so serioulsy injured. We need to determine how injured everyone is before we do that and go after Raven and Otto.
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Post by Wolfgar on May 17, 2005 11:49:27 GMT -5
I am always looking to upgrade my equipment. Assuming we find enough magic items worth divvying up there might be something I could trade you along with my +1 longsword for your +2.
I am guessing Al's morale is going to be pretty low after we raise him. One issue we will have to deal with is leaving him and Ironhand someplace safe while they recover. I still think heading north along the coast to Diego's home or back to Gradsul may be better bets than going into Highport at half strength and hoping an evil, high-level magic-user or cleric will want to help us for any amount of money. We do have that letter of introduction from Trevor Gat to the high priest of Pelor in Gradsul that might be useful. Another loose end is the Grey Lady which is still back in Blue. However, going back to Blue and then sailing some place to get Al raised is not likely to be feasible given the time it will take.
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Post by Dell on May 17, 2005 12:01:13 GMT -5
The way I see it, we should have "Fighter Fighter MU Cleric MU Fighter Fighter." The specifics will depend on which fighters are healthiest, and which magic users have spells ready. We need to get spells off earlier in battles, and to do that we need to have a magic user closer to the front.
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Post by Mr. Trommer on May 17, 2005 12:10:19 GMT -5
Where did Pavel go to?
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Post by Dell on May 17, 2005 12:40:50 GMT -5
I'm already counting Al as a loss - even if we get him raised, he's not likely to want to continue with us. In any case, Highport and Blue are the only places that we can reach within the 9 days that Al has to be raised, and we haven't seen any higher powered clerics in Blue. I suppose there's a small chance that Magical Trevor is 9th level - but the only one that would have a good idea of his actual power level is Cedrus, because he trained under him for a while.
We need to get Cedrus back in any event - I think that the vallue of the magic items he's carrying will more or less equal the cost of getting him un-ossified. Besides, he owes Dell money.
The plan, in any event, is to clear out this hole, find Melba, capture Markessa and take her spellbooks, and then... then we split up.
Someone needs to take Al and Cedrus to Highport to get them fixed, while the rest of the gang heads back to Blue with all the rescued slaves. Ideally, we trade cash and/or magic items for their reanimation, and guys from Blue come to pick us up in the ship a few days later.
How we survive in the city of Highport for so long is an interesting question.... it involves Winthrop making a cottage, though.
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Post by Dell on May 17, 2005 12:41:19 GMT -5
I don't think we want to know.
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Post by Ginger on May 17, 2005 12:57:58 GMT -5
Pavel and Diego are probably necessary to negociate with the high level priests in Blue. Since they won't let "good" people into the bar and they'll be suspicious of Dell, these guys are our best bet.
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Post by Ginger on May 17, 2005 13:03:52 GMT -5
I am always looking to upgrade my equipment. Assuming we find enough magic items worth divvying up there might be something I could trade you along with my +1 longsword for your +2. Since I don't have to worry about specialization and I have proficiencies to spare, I can take pretty much any magical weapon. Hopefully Icar's two-handed sword, or that glowing broadsword, will be +1 or better.
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cedrus
Junior Member
split personality
Posts: 51
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Post by cedrus on May 17, 2005 13:12:46 GMT -5
If any of you were telepathic, you'd immediately hear Cedrus thinking over and over again: "SOMEONE UNPETRIFY ME SO THAT I CAN PAY DELL WHAT I OWE HIM!"
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Post by Ginger on May 17, 2005 13:28:29 GMT -5
To raise Al we need at least a level 9 cleric (+1 level per day Al is dead past 9), and to cast Flesh to Stone we need a 11th level magic user or a scroll of Flesh to Stone. Hopefully we can find a shady character in Blue who will trade us a Flesh to Stone casting for Protection from Normal Missles and/or Leomund's Secure Shelter.
I guess the idea scenario is that Markessa has that spell in her book or on a scroll. Alternativelly, maybe we'll find a potion or something in one of the boxes we found. After all, this is a module with a medusa (assuming she isn't Dana's invention) so there should be a cure somewhere in the same module.
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Post by Dell on May 17, 2005 13:39:42 GMT -5
Hopefully Icar's two-handed sword, or that glowing broadsword, will be +1 or better. Judging from Pavel's behavior, the only way you're going to get that glowing sword is if it's going into your back and coming out of the front of your chest.
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Post by Ginger on May 17, 2005 13:44:07 GMT -5
I think Pavel understands that sometimes arrows go astray, and three arrows going astray into his back, or face, will change his mind.
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Post by Dell on May 17, 2005 13:47:24 GMT -5
I guess the idea scenario is that Markessa has that spell in her book or on a scroll. Alternativelly, maybe we'll find a potion or something in one of the boxes we found. After all, this is a module with a medusa (assuming she isn't Dana's invention) so there should be a cure somewhere in the same module. Yeah, that's a good hope right there. It would be funny if it's in one of these boxes that we haven't opened yet. Still doesn't raise Al, though. At this point, I'd almost rather have him reincarnated - his Con wll drop another point if he's raised, but with reincarnation he'd get all new rolls he'd have a chance for some better stats, and odds are he'd be humanoid size, so it'd be easier to find armor for him. We can polymorph him back into a dwarf later.
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Post by Dell on May 17, 2005 13:56:18 GMT -5
I think Pavel understands that sometimes arrows go astray, and three arrows going astray into his back, or face, will change his mind. You'd have to know where he is to do that. Hell, he could disguise himself and you'd never know what was going on until "Winthrop" put a knife into your eyeball.
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Post by Ginger on May 17, 2005 14:14:41 GMT -5
Fortunately, having 40 HP lets me take a few daggers to the eyeballs. And I've been poisoned enough times to have developed a decent immunity.
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