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Post by Ginger on Oct 24, 2006 15:58:24 GMT -5
Turrosh Mak is a hobgoblin chieftan in the Pomarj. When we rescued the slaves from the slaver stockade he was marching his forces to the stockade to take it over. We were fortunately already gone by then. He sent a few guys riding dragonnels after us, but they were defeated.
I think I'm going to have my luckstone surgically implanted in my chest to protect it. Either that or have a series of duplicates made.
I like the notion of rescuing the great druid, but how on earth can we find him? I assume that the druids are not so stupid as to not attempt to scry him. Other than that, where do we begin?
Also, we should scry Karmack's tower a few more times. I don't remember what we saw other than the magic user. We need to confirm that he's evil before we storm the tower. It would be very unfortunate if refuges from Sterich have retreated to the tower or something like that and we kill everyone inside.
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Post by venger on Oct 24, 2006 17:25:46 GMT -5
Turrosh Mak is a hobgoblin chieftan in the Pomarj. Turrosh Mak is supposedly a big deal over in the Pomarj. I like the notion of rescuing the great druid, but how on earth can we find him? I assume that the druids are not so stupid as to not attempt to scry him. Other than that, where do we begin? Either the druid or the Silent One. Aren't there more Silent Ones in the area? Like a society of these secretive lawful neutral magic-user types? Best place to probably start looking is in the Dreadwood and then west from there. Is the Great Druid Reynard Yargrove? Maybe he has a personal, sacred grove, or a dwelling we could search. Thion would know. Finding and questioning the elusive Keefe O'Mara might also be a good way to start. How well does that magical talking hound track things again? Divination spell? Commune? Speak to plants and animals? I'm sure evil demon-controlled druids make all kinds of bad impressions on the local flora/fauna. A grand convocation of druids was brought together and before this august gathering, Reynard Yargrove, Druid of the Dreadwood, defeated Keefe O’Mara and retained his position.... The Druid was informed of a disturbance in the balance to the west, and he decided he must leave and attend to it... Reynard departed, but did not soon return. All went well, except soon cracks appeared within the orders... Thion was most concerned and sent one of his fellow druids of Obad-hai in search of the Druid, hoping to bring him back.
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Post by Ginger on Oct 24, 2006 17:36:22 GMT -5
There are a lot of hobgoblins in the Pomarj, thus being a cheiftain is a big deal. Tracking down Keefe O'Mara might be a good start. we could just track down the most powerful druid in 500 miles and see who we find. Either way it would be a good start.
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Post by venger on Oct 24, 2006 17:49:19 GMT -5
There are a lot of hobgoblins in the Pomarj, thus being a cheiftain is a big deal. My implication was that he was somewhat famous in Greyhawk canon. That's all. Tracking down Keefe O'Mara might be a good start. we could just track down the most powerful druid in 500 miles and see who we find. Either way it would be a good start. Yeah... We should also probably notify the druids and everybody else we want to be not-turned-into-undead about the complete annihilation of Flen, the vast cloud of darkness hovering above its ruin and the presumed routing of whatever Keoish army stood on this side of the Javan River. Sir Highrider might appreciate the news. We may be the only survivors of the Flen massacre that have any idea what actually happened. Let's go find the Druid. I owe someone a knot potion, and I can't think of any other way to repay that debt. I wouldn't mention to Oaklock that we are thinking of delaying the trip to Gorna on account of finding this Druid. He seems kind of on edge.
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Post by Dell on Oct 24, 2006 22:15:44 GMT -5
My implication was that he was somewhat famous in Greyhawk canon. That's all. According to Wikipedia Adrienne's visions of the future: "During the Greyhawk Wars of 582-584 CY, a powerful orc chieftain named Turrosh Mak united the Nedla and other humanoid tribes of the Pomarj, and invaded the surrounding lands, bringing much of the Wild Coast and the Principality of Ulek under his control. Mak named his "empire where none has stood" the Orcish Empire of the Pomarj." Since that's 16 years in the future, we can just kill him now and save a lot of people a lot of hassle. I wouldn't mention to Oaklock that we are thinking of delaying the trip to Gorna on account of finding this Druid. He seems kind of on edge. Oaklock doesn't care - he'll just teleport away after his year of service is done, if we're not where he wants to be.
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Post by Ginger on Oct 25, 2006 10:49:25 GMT -5
Can we please handle the war we're in now before worrying about the next decade's war? After this we'll go back to the Pomarj and take the country over.
Also, lets keep our focus. We know that Geoff is under seige. Karmuck's tower is strategically important if it's held by the enemy. For all we know its their key supply base for the country. I'd imagine that capturing it and making it a supply point for the good guys would be very important. Speaking of that tower, who was the Gorna Guard guy we rescued? Did we ever ask Oaklock about him? If we're invading the tower, maybe we could coordinate with them.
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Post by venger on Oct 25, 2006 11:07:56 GMT -5
Also, lets keep our focus. We know that Geoff is under seige. Karmuck's tower is strategically important if it's held by the enemy. For all we know its their key supply base for the country. I'd imagine that capturing it and making it a supply point for the good guys would be very important. How near is that tower to Oytpass Keep? Maybe some of your buddies from the White Crows are still serving sentence as guardsmen. "The forces of weal are too disorganized to meet us and we continue to grow in strength. Oytkeep still resists, but access to Geoff is complete. Once I hear back from Grugnir, we, and our ally to the north, will close off Geoff from all aid."
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Post by Ginger on Oct 25, 2006 11:23:31 GMT -5
We visited Oytpass keep on the way to the tower. I don't know how close it is.
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Eig
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Post by Eig on Oct 25, 2006 11:48:21 GMT -5
As an aside, I'm not particularly comfortable with leading said undead baddie into the Knot, aka. My Homelend. Not my idea of a fun time.
I'm all for trying to take control of Karmak's Tower's, but I truly believe that the circlet is bad news. If's it really a skelton warrior, it will dissapear when it gets the circlet, so no problem there. The stuff we have posted here seems to imply that Kay-Tarn is some sort of Great Lord. Who is this Krukshank fellow who seems to be at least vaugely in league with Stalman Klim, who can actually control Kay-Tarn?
Also, upon review of the documents, I find it much more likely that the undead horde that took Flen and Kay-Tarn are allied.
Either way, what is the next course of action?
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Post by Mr. Trommer on Oct 25, 2006 12:21:36 GMT -5
Well, if we go through Oytpass Keep that would sorta mean that the our following undead army would also. That doesn't seem to be a good thing to have happen.
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Post by Ginger on Oct 25, 2006 12:21:56 GMT -5
To start with, we head north. There's a nice, open plain north of us. We can travel quickly and spot enemies approaching us. While traveling we can do a lot of scrying on our targets. We can use divination to attempt to locate the Great Druid or Keefe O'Mara. We can try to keep track of the various undead things in the area. We can check the Karmack's tower to see who's currently occupying it. If we decide to fight whatever's chasing us, we can rest a few days to allow Eig the opportunity to train with Herbert.
Also, everyone needs to remember that we have no evidence that the thing attached to the circlet is Kay-Tarn. The thing following us may or may not be a lich. The thing following us may or may not be Kay-Tarn. Kay Tarn is likely a lich, but possibly not.
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Post by Mr. Trommer on Oct 25, 2006 13:56:02 GMT -5
So next time Dell puts on the circlet he needs to have cast Clairavoyance, Clairauduence, and ESP. Hugh can cast Prayer, Bless, Protection form Evil and Trithereions Mark to give a an extra +3 save vs mind stuff. Oh and the Luck Stone. That should give him an extra +7. Then maybe he can read his mind or something.
We will also need to do the same thing will scrying the other places as well.
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Eig
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Post by Eig on Oct 25, 2006 14:34:44 GMT -5
Then maybe he can read his mind or something. My point wasn't that he was failing the saving throw, my point was that Dell may not be high enough level to control him, even if he was in the 240 feet or whatever distance it is. I'm really of the opinion that he needs to be a higher level Magic-User that the baddie, which would be nearly impossible if it's a Lich. That said, if we're traveling anyway, there's really no point in not trying. Also, if all it wants is to get the circlet back and be at rest, there is absolutely no reason we can't loot its horde afterward. Also, even if we do manage to kill it, it can't tell us where it's horde is when it's dead, and since it's been dead for quite a while, casting speak with dead won't work. Reynard, the Great Druid, went west. West is where the good guys are. We shouldn't bring the undead horde traipsing through the territory of what few allies haven't fallen to the undead yet. I'd say our best bet is to look for a/the Silent One, but knowing about where the Great Druid is probably isn't a bad idea. Evidence points to the fact that the thing attached to the circlet is not a Lich, for three reasons: 1) Used a two-handed sword. Liches form from Magic-Users who are too stubborn to die (sort of). Magic-Users cannot use two-handed swords. Chances are, he didn't multi-class to gain that proficiency. 2) Walked underwater. A lich is a very powerful undead wizard. It's a little odd that he didn't just sort of walk on water. See Tony's post. 3) Hasn't killed us yet. See above, but replace "walk on water" with "destroy us in way our minds could never comprehend". See posts above for other suggestions, and other debunks of said suggestions. On that note, sorry I've been such a butt about shooting down said suggestions. Kay-Tarn is implied to be a Great Lord. Kay-Tarn is specifically mentioned as being controlled. A Great Lord probably isn't controlled by non-magical means. This points to the circlet controlling Kay-Tarn.
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Post by Ginger on Oct 25, 2006 15:15:08 GMT -5
I think a lot of the confusion comes from three propositions we believe to be likely, but are contradictory. 1) Kay Tarn is a lich. 2) The creature attached to the circlet is Kay Tarn. 3) The creature attached to the circlet is not a lich.
Reasons we believe each: 1) We were told by our captive in Longspear that Kay Tarn is an evil being who performs odd rituals/experiments in his lair by the Davish river which create undead creatures. Assuming he's an undead creature, they tend not to have much initiative or creativity. Liches are the only undead which tend to display such characteristics. A lich seems like the most likely candidate to lead an undead army, as skeleton warriors are loners. Therefore, Kay Tarn is a lich.
2) A priest of Nerul was very close to Kay Tarn's lair to find a powerful undead creature. It seems like to much of a coincidence for a circlet which controlls a powerful undead creature to be found right next to the lair of a different powerful undead creature.
3) If a lich specifically wanted us dead, we'd be dead already. Or undead.
If you asked me, I'd say that (2) is the false assumption. I think the skeleton warrior might have been entombed in Kay Tarn's lair, but without the circlet Kay Tarn had no control over him. When Dell first donned the circlet, the undead seemed to be roused, and it seems that Kay Tarn was already active at that point.
As another point, Winthrop had a mightly powerful sword which was enchanted to be usable by wizards. Ask him about it, he'll talk to you for hours. Or become enraged and fry you with lightning.
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Post by Mr. Trommer on Oct 25, 2006 15:16:34 GMT -5
Ah, so you are suggesting that I put on the circlet! Jolly good idea. I'll give that undead thing the what for and show him whos boss.
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Post by Ginger on Oct 25, 2006 15:21:25 GMT -5
I'm happy with Dell being the one to feel the sweet embrace of unlife risk himself for the Party.
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Post by venger on Oct 25, 2006 15:38:56 GMT -5
Ah, so you are suggesting that I put on the circlet! Jolly good idea. I'll give that undead thing the what for and show him whos boss. Good form, Master Winthrop! Good form! 2) Walked underwater. A lich is a very powerful undead wizard. It's a little odd that he didn't just sort of walk on water. See Tony's post. Assuming he's an undead creature, they tend not to have much initiative or creativity. Liches are the only undead which tend to display such characteristics. A lich seems like the most likely candidate to lead an undead army, as skeleton warriors are loners. Therefore, Kay Tarn is a lich. It occurs to me that the lich is not necessarily an undead magic-user. Powerful clerics are just as capable of becoming liches as wizards. Just something to consider.
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Post by Ginger on Oct 25, 2006 15:45:57 GMT -5
That's much better. We just killed a 15th level cleric last month, so an 18th level cleric/lich is much less frightening.
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Eig
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Post by Eig on Oct 25, 2006 15:49:36 GMT -5
I think a lot of the confusion comes from three propositions we believe to be likely, but are contradictory. 1) Kay Tarn is a lich. 2) The creature attached to the circlet is Kay Tarn. 3) The creature attached to the circlet is not a lich. Honestly, though you make a good point, I beleive that 1) is the false assumption. Here's why: 1) Kay-Tarn is explictly mentioned as beign controlled by Stalman Klim. This supports #2. 2) Kay Tarn is referred to as a Great Lord. Lich != Great Lord. Thus, #1 is false. 3) The creature attached to the circlet was walking under water, thus #3 is probably true, as discussed before. 4) Kay-Tarn has a horde. Liches tend to be solitary, thus Kay-Tarn is probably not a Lich. Thus, #1 is false. 5) Liches spend most to all of their time researching new magics. Kay-Tarn has been active in the world for some time, concluding his is not a Lich. Thus, #1 is false. 6) As ArrowGuy said, the chances of finding a powerful artifact that controls a different creature in a given creautre's lair are low. The Nerullite priest was exploring Kay-Tarn's lair. Therefore we can conclude that to most likely object that the circlet will control is Kay-Tarn. Thus, #2 is true. Tony, the thing attached to the circlet is probably not a cleric either. See the "Part Water" and "Lower Water" spells, as well as the discussion of walking underwater.
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Post by Mr. Trommer on Oct 25, 2006 16:06:45 GMT -5
Details, details, details. All this talk is irrelevant. We will kill or be killed. Well, at least a few of us but no matter. It is evil and it wants Dell. That's fine an good since we can destroy it while it goes after Dell. After all since Dell has the circlet it, whatever It's name is, probably will want to suck out Dell's soul first. We just have to take care of the other undead with it. Dell can can keep It busy in the meanwhile. Then we can take it out if Dell with his "superior", cough...cough, intellect defeats it mind to mind. That shounds like a excellent plan to me considering how well our plans normally go.
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Post by Ginger on Oct 25, 2006 16:07:26 GMT -5
I think I disagree with your assumption that Kay Tarn is the "Great Lord." Let's go to the relevant text: Mind these words well. The undead ride towards you under the command of Kay-Tarn. Klim has demanded Kay-Tarn assist him rather than you, and it seems likely that the Great Lord will accede. Klim has a long history that I do not understand, nor would I place in such a note as this. Suffice it to say, you must plan to take Longspear without additional aid from the Great Lord.
I don't think Kay Tarn is the Great Lord. I think the Great Lord may be the Dead God himself, since he seems to be a very hands-on guy. Caladon and Klim both wanted the assistance of Kay Tarn and his horde, and the Great Lord decided that Klim gets the help. Additionally, I think "assist" is much weaker than "be controlled by." I think Klim and Kay Tarn are both in service to the Dead God, and so Kay Tarn is a team player and does what he's told.
Perhaps it's most likely that both my original (1) and (2) are false.
Either way, the important thing is that if we're sure the thing following us is not a lich, then we should arrange for us to meet it on the plains somewhere during the day and kill/question it.
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Eig
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Post by Eig on Oct 25, 2006 16:12:47 GMT -5
I think I disagree with your assumption that Kay Tarn is the "Great Lord." Let's go to the relevant text: Mind these words well. The undead ride towards you under the command of Kay-Tarn. Klim has demanded Kay-Tarn assist him rather than you, and it seems likely that the Great Lord will accede. Klim has a long history that I do not understand, nor would I place in such a note as this. Suffice it to say, you must plan to take Longspear without additional aid from the Great Lord. I don't think Kay Tarn is the Great Lord. I think the Great Lord may be the Dead God himself, since he seems to be a very hands-on guy. Caladon and Klim both wanted the assistance of Kay Tarn and his horde, and the Great Lord decided that Klim gets the help. Additionally, I think "assist" is much weaker than "be controlled by." I think Klim and Kay Tarn are both in service to the Dead God, and so Kay Tarn is a team player and does what he's told. Perhaps it's most likely that both my original (1) and (2) are false. Either way, the important thing is that if we're sure the thing following us is not a lich, then we should arrange for us to meet it on the plains somewhere during the day and kill/question it. I agree that that particular contention is weak. However, I believe we still have enough evidence to assume that Kay-Tarn is attached to the circlet and not a lich. I also agree that the plain is a good place to do some scouting on this circlet-obsessed fellow.
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Post by Dell on Oct 25, 2006 17:41:06 GMT -5
Skeleton Warriors, Death Knights, and Liches have this in common - before they achieved a state of undeath, they were notable personages. If we were to consult a sage or a well appointed library, we could likely find a bit about his history, and decide more conclusively what Kay-Tarn is, and whether he is in fact the entity chasing me.
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Post by venger on Oct 25, 2006 17:45:11 GMT -5
Master Winthrop makes a good point, as always.
But we don't get to play again until Sunday and my real life is singularly uninteresting right now, so...
1) The creature chasing the circlet is most likely not a spellcaster of any major ability- as evidenced by its tireless journey on foot, through river and field.
(i could be wrong, maybe he is so overburdened with finger of death spells that he can't walk on water, teleport or fly right now)
2) Kay-Tarn is most likely a spellcaster, either cleric or mage, as evidenced by his undead factory. Unless he's some kind of Dr. Frankenstein stitching these undeads together and animating them with "weird science."
Why don't we use some of our divination efforts toward finding out the name of the creature linked to the circlet? If we could find out anything history-wise about the circlet I'm sure it would be that.
Which would answer some of those annoying questions by elimination.
From the context of the letter I was under the impression that "the Great Lord" was whoever was directly behind the effort to raise the dead god. Stalman Klim being his erstwhile ally.
"Klim has demanded Kay-Tarn assist him rather than you, and it seems likely that the Great Lord will accede."
I'm doubting anyone is actually making direct demands of this all-powerful dead god. Or that He Who Must Not Be Named would ever accede to a demand in the first place.
At the end of the letter Krukshank writes:
"May the Lord of All suck the light from your eyes."
Which may just be their way of saying "hope everybody's well, see you at Thanksgiving."
But it sounds like a more reverent title than just "Great Lord."
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Post by venger on Oct 25, 2006 17:47:43 GMT -5
Skeleton Warriors, Death Knights, and Liches have this in common - before they achieved a state of undeath, they were notable personages. If we were to consult a sage or a well appointed library, we could likely find a bit about his history, and decide more conclusively what Kay-Tarn is, and whether he is in fact the entity chasing me. You should probably just ask someone. "You are surprised to learn that Kay-Tarn is an old preacher down by the Javan River that tells fisherfolk about the WaterDragon and the blessings of a good catch." Do we even know that Stalman Klim is their leader? Perhaps he is just a high ranking member turned to the worship of a dark god, or some imposter planted in the ranks of "The Black Lotus?" 2 points for the new guy! He wasn't even in the Thieves' Guild!
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Post by Ginger on Oct 25, 2006 17:58:46 GMT -5
2 points for the new guy! He wasn't even in the Thieves' Guild! There'll be an extra gold piece for you at the end of the month. Way to go.
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Post by venger on Oct 25, 2006 18:08:52 GMT -5
There'll be an extra gold piece for you at the end of the month. Way to go. Do not think I have not already written that extra gold down on my character sheet! I am Master Dell's apprentice after all.
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Post by Dell on Oct 25, 2006 18:34:33 GMT -5
There'll be an extra gold piece for you at the end of the month. Way to go. Do not think I have not already written that extra gold down on my character sheet! Is the month over yet?
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Post by venger on Oct 25, 2006 21:02:41 GMT -5
Trip from Longspear was two weeks.
We spent a couple days in Flen.
Six days finding each other in the Good Hills.
However else long sorting out refugees.
That's a month right??
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Post by Ginger on Oct 25, 2006 21:51:26 GMT -5
Skeleton Warriors, Death Knights, and Liches have this in common - before they achieved a state of undeath, they were notable personages. If we were to consult a sage or a well appointed library, we could likely find a bit about his history, and decide more conclusively what Kay-Tarn is, and whether he is in fact the entity chasing me. Well, we know Algorthas the Sage in the neighborhood. He is hopefully still here. Other than that, most of the libraries are unaccessable. Oaklock could probable send a research request to the Guard. Maybe they'll find something. Dell could maybe send something to Elmo also.
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